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How Do I Get my Vista Back now Ubuntu 8.04 install has screwed everything !!

(47 posts)
  • Started 6 years ago by StevePaul
  • Latest reply from StevePaul
  • Topic Viewed 5186 times

raphoenix
Posts: 14920

POST DELETED by raphoenix 09/12/2008

Posted 6 years ago
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ScottW
Posts: 6609

Rick, you make it sound like it's either RAID 0 or 1 on that Inspiron. There is a third choice: no RAID, just 2 hard disks. Also, why are you recommending Ghost? To wipe the hard drives, including the MBR if it's stuck on GRUB, the OP can use DBAN:
http://www.dban.org/

Also, for anyone who wants to know, it does appear that Ubuntu can be run on the Inspiron 1721 according to this link:
http://stevetells.wordpress.co.....iron-1721/

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

POST DELETED by raphoenix 09/12/2008

Posted 6 years ago
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ScottW
Posts: 6609

StevePaul, from searching around it looks like Ctrl-F is the keystroke that will get you into the RAID setup menu at boot time. However, Dell does not seem to have any information about this at their website, so they might not support non-RAID on this system. You should probably ask Dell first, if you are considering this option.

Using the link to the Ubuntu community wiki-looking thing, I found this short article (heavy sarcasm there) on how to install Ubuntu on a PC with Windows and built-in RAID, which they call FakeRAID:
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FakeRaidHowto

I mentioned DBAN for wiping the disks because it's freeware.

Posted 6 years ago
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StevePaul
Posts: 99

Yeah I read this too ...

Can get into the BIOS settings easy enough but it won't allow you tp switch the Raid off ...

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

StevePaul,

From my post on the First Page, I said "There has been a long standing augment on what RAID really is."

I'm NOT sure your machine has a Bios setting for not locking the HD's in Raid 0 or Raid 10 once the Bios / Controller sees (2) HDs installed.

I made a comment in an earlier post that I think it (might????) be possible to run Ubuntu in a Raid 10 configuration but am not sure since the HDs just duplicate each other in partitions and read / writes.

In this machine, I can configure the Sata HDs as non-raid but of course this is an ATX MB with a different Intel Chipset.

Suggest you call Dell because I had a "heavy" discussion with HP concerning their Dual HD Laptop PCs when they first came out last year.
In their case, they really did try to use software to make a raid configuration.
Don't know what they use now.
Did you see your Grand Kids ??
Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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0zSpitt
Posts: 1037

if i restart and hit <control-i>, i can get to my raid settings. i've never messed with it but ive seen "raid off-on" and other settings. i'm not sure if this has anything to do with this. just thought i'd through it in...

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

@0z,

You have nailed the problem in this thread.

We don't know what Bios / controller settings (StevePaul) has because the on-line manual does not go into detail.

I doubt the documentation which came with his machine is much better.

If I had a look at the machine, I could easily tell what his machine is capable of but that's the problem.

Seems no one on the forum has that particular machine ether so they can jump-in.

We are all just (guessing) how his Bios / Controller can be setup for the Laptop Dual HDs.
Do you have a Dell Inspiron 1721 ????
Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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ScottW
Posts: 6609

I don't own an Inspiron 1721, but I do know that it can't do RAID 10 when it sees 2 hard disks installed. RAID 10 is a shortcut for RAID 1+0 or 0+1 -- the usage is not standard. So, that's either a mirrored set of striped sets or a striped set of mirrored sets. Either way, you need at least 4 hard disks to make a RAID 0+1 or 1+0 (or "10") set.

As far as I know, there is no "standard" for RAID at least not one from a standards body such as IEEE or ITU-T. Is there? It seems to me to be an ad hoc standard, but if someone knows of a defined standard please send me a pointer. As a result, I suppose that it's easy to argue about what RAID really is because no one can point back to THE standard and say, "that's what RAID is".

And in case it seems like I'm contradicting myself, my definition of RAID 10 is based on my understanding of the ad hoc standard.

Finally, back-to-topic: helping StevePaul. We know that someone deleted the RAID set on an Inspiron 1721 and blogged about it. We know that the Ubuntu community wiki has instructions about how to install Ubuntu in a dual boot config with Windows on a PC with BIOS-assisted RAID. However, that kind of anecdotal evidence is not very reassuring and there is a lot of risk involved. I wouldn't do it. From what I have seen, the Wubi installer for Ubuntu seems like the way to go for a Wintel PC user who wants to run Ubuntu. No messing with the MBR and if Ubuntu doesn't like your system, just uninstall it from Windows.

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

@ScottW,

Agree with you about the non-standard definition of raid.
That is why I included it in one of my first post. Please Look back through the thread.
However disagree that mirroring requires (4) HDs.
The Bios / controller can be locked into (Mirroring) with only (2) HDs.
Mirroring just requires an (Even Number of HDs) preferably all of the same capacity, cache amount and transfer speed.
======================
I am mirroring (2) Sata hard drives as I write this post SO it can be done very easily !!!!
======================
As for helping (StevePaul), I suggest the simplest and quickest solution to his problem is just to wipe the HDs and Clean Install Vista as he says he has an OEM complete copy of Vista.
======================
Lets not argue and engage in "one-ups-man-ship" as we have BOTH been setting-up computer systems and coding for very, very many long years.
There really is NO need for us to try to prove how much we know.
I DO respect your knowledge and hope that you would respect mine.
"Hatchet buried as for as I am concerned" :) :) - Thanks Rick P.

======================
Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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ScottW
Posts: 6609

Rick P., I'm not arguing with you, just setting the record straight. Your usage of RAID 10 was incorrect according to the ad hoc standard which is what is widely accepted. I have provided links to back up my statements because I am not trying to prove what I know, but trying to insure that people can do their own research and not just take my word. We can have this debate, civilly, in another thread. I will not reply to this thread again except to help the OP.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAID

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

ScottW,
Agree that helping (StevePaul) should be OUR UTMOST Priority.
The old Raid discussion has been around for 15-20 years or more. Remember sometimes days and weeks were devoted to it on the old Asus News Group with folks getting angry, using foul language and all the rest. No real value in going over 15-20 years of plowed ground again for us both.
Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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StevePaul
Posts: 99

Hi Guys, sorry for the delay in responding to your comments, after the trauma of trying to install Ubuntu I decided to have a few days away !!
Anyway the upshot is that after numerous attempts to get Ubuntu working I decided to 'grasp the nettle' and do a clean install of Vista.

Apart from a few items that I hadn't gor backed up everything went well.

I used the option to use all of my disk to install ...

Just for the hell of it I used the Ubuntu Live CD to look at my disc setup

The strange thing is Windows thinks all my disk is a NTFS partition whereas the Ubuntu Live CD see it as 2 discs 1 with NTFS and the other with various Linux stuff on it.

ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo fdisk -l
Disk /dev/sda: 160.0 GB, 160041885696 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19457 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
Disk identifier: 0xf8000000

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 * 1 38899 312448000 7 HPFS/NTFS

Disk /dev/sdb: 160.0 GB, 160041885696 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 19457 cylinders
Units = cylinders of 16065 * 512 = 8225280 bytes
Disk identifier: 0x000c28ef

Device Boot Start End Blocks Id System
/dev/sdb1 1 2586 20772013+ 83 Linux
/dev/sdb2 2587 19457 135516307+ 5 Extended
/dev/sdb5 18754 19457 5654848+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris /
/dev/sdb6 2587 18091 124543849+ 83 Linux
/dev/sdb7 18092 18753 5317483+ 82 Linux swap / Solaris

Partition table entries are not in disk order ubuntu@ubuntu:~$

Its not causing me any problems, but any ideas why Ubuntu is showing it like this ...

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

StevePaul,

Both HDs needed to be wiped (Zeroed Out Completely) and a Clean Install performed from Scratch.
The Bios can probably be set before the Clean Install to:
1. NO raid
2. Raid 0 Stripe
3. Raid 1 Mirror
Only guessing at Bios Settings as you have to look at possibilities in your machine.
I have no documentation.
Post back.
Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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StevePaul
Posts: 99

Thought it was going to do this for me from the Install disk, especially I as I told it to use all the disk !!

Could I use Knoppix or Gparted to delete the partitions, shrink the disc and create a new partition as NTFS or just leave it unallocated ...

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

StevePaul,
Normally I carefully plan a system's configuration ahead of time.
Now you are getting into HD configuration (AFTER) O/S Installation.
Since I always do HD Preparation (BEFORE) O/S Installation, I'm going to default to one of the other members for a good solution to your existing issue now.
Keep watching your thread.

Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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StevePaul
Posts: 99

As I said, thought it would do it for me ...

How come windows sees it different to Linux ?

Is nothing ever easy ?

Once again thanks for your help ...

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

StevePaul,
Many members are not retired but working US/Time Zone.
Someone will jump-in to help I feel sure.
What is shown in Vista disk management ??

Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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StevePaul
Posts: 99

Shows it as full available space (297Gb) NTFS
Healthy (System Boot,Page File, Active, Crash Dump, Primary Partition)

Posted 6 years ago
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raphoenix
Posts: 14920

StevePaul,

If Vista Disk Management is showing (1) partition of around 300 Gigs, then the system is running in Raid 0.
When you look at the system in Ubuntu Live Disk, it cannot recognize Raid 0 so you are getting a false report, so to speak, in simplified terms.

If your system has no other problems, then you are probably good to go.
This is just my best guess as to what is happening on your machine.

Kindest Regards,
Rick P. ♥ :)

Posted 6 years ago
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